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Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Discussion of tenkara lines, tippets, etc...

Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby jd_smith » Mon Jul 07, 2014 10:31 am

A few things you guys might try are the Juntan Marker Beads indicator from Tenkarabum.http://www.tenkarabum.com/micro-fishing-floats.html

Another option is to use the Umpqua Bi-Colored tippet material in 2X as an entire line or just a partial line indicator. If you use some of the lightest sizes and furl it, you can come up with a very unique hi vis line/indicator.Image

Jan Siman inline indicator material. Image

Or use one of these pre-made leaders.Image

I've been using an indicator called 7 Dot with my Czech setup and it works very well. It's basically the same as the Jintan markers but in hi-vis. Unfortunately though, I don't think they're made anymore, because I can't find them anywhere.

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Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby johnlaudenslager » Mon Jul 07, 2014 12:03 pm

jd -

Would you use the Juntan Beads if you didn't have 7 Dots?

Is the Umpqua Bi-Colored material in, say, the 2x you mention, as visible as T-Bum's #3 Orange or TUSA's #3 Pink?

The Jan Simon indicator material pictured is hugely thick. Would you use it if you didn't have 7 Dots?

Have you used the Umpqua Red Hot Power Taper enough to know its pros and cons?
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Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby farmer » Mon Jul 07, 2014 7:14 pm

A tapered nylon tenkara line in bright opaque fluorescent orange or green may be of interest. My copy/paste quit working but if you google "tenkara midi line" it will come right up. I've tried it and was pleased with the cast ability and visibility. Good luck with your quest.
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Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby johnlaudenslager » Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:28 pm

Having tried various in-line alternatives, I'm pretty sold on having the whole line be the indicator. I like that if my eye even only discerns part of the line it is often enough to tell what is happening to the fly.

I'm going to try the "Light Midi Line", 3.3m length. T Bum is out but I assume he will have it again.
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Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby jd_smith » Sat Jul 12, 2014 8:52 am

johnlaudenslager wrote:jd -

Would you use the Juntan Beads if you didn't have 7 Dots?

Is the Umpqua Bi-Colored material in, say, the 2x you mention, as visible as T-Bum's #3 Orange or TUSA's #3 Pink?

The Jan Simon indicator material pictured is hugely thick. Would you use it if you didn't have 7 Dots?

Have you used the Umpqua Red Hot Power Taper enough to know its pros and cons?


Yes i would use the Jintan markers if I didn't have some of the 7 Dots. I would rig them on a hi-vis line and color them (probably black or maybe pink) to give contrast.

The Umpqua material is as hi-vis as any other. The neat thing is that it's two colors alternating every foot of so. It's nylon, very supple and is solid color not translucent line like some of the fluorocarbon lines.

The Jan Simon inline indicator material comes in several different diameters and the lightest is about 4X in comparison. Thats about 6lb test and equal to a 1.5 tenkara line. Very lightweight.

I don't use the Red Hot power taper, because I'm more of a DIY'er, and also, I rarely use a line of only 10' in length. Long rod short line. It's best for nymphing IMO. A line of only 10' is so short that I feel it can be made of almost any line size (1.5-4.5) and still work well.

The caveat here is that I don't fish any of these options for tenkara. :o Every option here are what I would and do use while tightline or Euro nymphing. However i wouldn't recommend them If I wasn't sure that they will work very well if constructed properly. Chris Stewart made me some really sweet hand tapered tenkara lines a few years ago (that I still use often) and two of the four that I have are "Bi-Colored" lines. When I wear them out I'll just build my own. I'm not sure that Chris is still building line's, and I now have enough different diameters to come up with plenty of custom lines.

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Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby johnlaudenslager » Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:29 pm

Thanks, JD.

Chris Stewart just sent something to me that makes me think I should try flying indicators again. Maybe instead of the tapered line. He apparently had very good luck recently using keiru rigging with little yarn tuft indicators, especially fluorescent yellow, on VERY thin level line. And he used flies instead of keiryu bait. His Trip Report 7-6-14 describes his findings.

That you describe the Umpqua line as hi-viz opaque rather than translucent makes me want to try some. I'll get some.
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Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby johnlaudenslager » Sat Aug 09, 2014 3:49 pm

Several posts back jd pictured a spool of 4X Umpqua bi-color indicator material and mentioned that 2X might make a good whole nylon line. I tried 4X first. Though amazingly visible at 008" diameter it was not quite visible enough for me. Then I tried 2x and found that even at .009" it was more visible than the .010", 10# Amnesia I previously favored. So it is my new favorite line.

Surprisingly, the green portions are more visible, at least through my eyes and polaroids, than even the orange portions, no matter what the background and light at the several waters I fish. I had never tried any green lines before so I don't know if that quality is unique to this material.

I tried yarn indicators again but still prefer the simplicity of just the line as the indicator when it is visible enough, which this is.

As always, I am not recommending nylon over fluorocarbon to cast unweighted or bushy flies. Such flies benefit by the increased density and therefor superior aerodynamic castability of fluorocarbon. Less dense light nylon however shines with beadhead flies. Beadhead flies carry the line. Then after the cast, nylon, especially thin nylon, bows less from weight and from wind drag and gives the straightest possible connection to the fly.
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Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby johnlaudenslager » Wed Mar 25, 2015 12:16 pm

Having used nylon lines another season I have a somewhat different favorite setup now. Maybe because I use yellow polaroids, and or because my water and bank backgrounds are brownish, green line is more visible than orange. It was easy to tell that when using Umpqua Bi-Color which is orange-green. Maybe because I am old, getting older, I also decided I liked the visibility of a thicker line.

Thicker line could have been a no go for weighed nymph fly drift management in local winds, but I now prefer a longer rod, 13' instead of 12', and a shorter line, now 7' plus 3' tippet, which conveniently puts less line out there to be bowed by wind or its own weight.

And I have settled on Sunset Amnesia again because it is visible enough and cheaper than Umpqua Bi-Color. I also went back and retried several popular 2.5 and 3.0 fluorocarbons for this shorter line, but they still noticeably bowed more of their own weight compared to this nylon.

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Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby jasonkonopinski » Mon Sep 14, 2015 8:04 am

I'm very interested in keiryu rods and techniques, especially for getting weighted nymphs into the deep pools.

For most of the streams I fish, there's a bit of canopy to contend with, so the extra length of keiryu rods may prove troublesome.
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Re: Thin nylon line & weighed flies

Postby johnlaudenslager » Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:14 am

Jason - Regarding rod length for overhead canopy, I can't advise anything other than to guess at a rod length, try, and see. Zoom rods should be best but some (most?) of them actually feel so much better at one position than another that I and I think others usually use them at one length. Then, hey, non-zoom rods can be held a foot or two shorter than designed and still cast and feel good.

Regarding this thread's point of thin nylon line, its advantages compared to fluorocarbon are maximized and its disadvantages minimized when using some terminal weight, as in keiryu or in "tenkara" with weighted flies. You know, some would say that using weighed flies or a keiryu rod is not Tenkara and maybe shouldn't be on this forum. TenkaraBum has lots informative to say about Keiryu.
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