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New Ayu series II is now availible.

Discussion on tenkara rods

Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby craigthor » Thu Feb 07, 2013 12:47 pm

scorpion1971 wrote:About the only thing I do not like about the specs is the weight of 102 grams or 3.6 oz. Having cast some other popular Tenkara rods Japan makes most rods over 80 grams a heavy rod. If TUSA really wants to improve the rods the weight should be considered.

Mike P.


That would be a big plus, I know my current 3.8 meter rod is 2.3 oz or so if I remember right.
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Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby tsegelke » Thu Feb 07, 2013 5:29 pm

For those who has had a chance to use the new Ayu, how much of the softness did it lose? I was looking for the 5:5 feel, since I have the Iwana and Amago at the 6:4 already.
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Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby Tenkara Guides » Thu Feb 07, 2013 6:17 pm

tsegelke wrote:For those who has had a chance to use the new Ayu, how much of the softness did it lose? I was looking for the 5:5 feel, since I have the Iwana and Amago at the 6:4 already.


I don't quite know how I would classify the rod, it is kind of different. I would get away from the traditional tenkara rod rating system and call it a mid-flex, soft action rod whereas the original Ayu is a full-flex soft action rod. It is slightly stiffer than the orginal Ayu but softer than the Amago. Same thing with the backbone or fish fighting strength. Stronger than the original Ayu but slightly less than the Amago. It is in a category unique to the model.

I am interested in hearing what others will have to say as these rods get into circulation. I think it is a very nice rod but there will always be those that don't like it.

Just my thoughts from fishing with it. Your milage may vary.

John
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Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby Daniel @ Tenkara USA » Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:18 am

I did a writeup on the Ayu here: http://www.tenkarausa.com/blog/?p=4325
If TUSA really wants to improve the rods the weight should be considered.
- This is something I'm very observant of. There will be some lighter rods in the future, but the main thing I pay attention to is balance. I'm having a few of our main rods lean toward the heavier weight but very good balance, this will ensure their quality is not compromised with larger fish we find here. There are some rods that are super light but also break very easily, the new Ayu is very difficult to break on a fish.
And, part of the reason for going to a 6:4 is to get away from the classification system we have been using. It does not paint a complete picture but also confuses a lot of people. I'm still pondering the best way to approach this. My goal is to make super good tenkara rods, and I think the flex shouldn't matter so much to the end user. That's just my opinion, but I'm not yet settled on how to best approach this. Open to suggestions.
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Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby tiptop » Fri Feb 08, 2013 5:08 am

Tenkarabum's use of the "common cents system" accompanied with a photo showing several rods flexing together is very helpful -- much more so than the 5:5, 6:4, 7:3. A single photo on your website with all the TUSA rods flexing together (while weighted with their appropriate number of cents) would be very informative. Or in the case of the Ayu, a photo comparing the flex profiles of the new and the old together.

I don't really understand what you mean by balance. Unless a 13.5' 102g rod has lead weight in the butt cap, I think it's going to feel relatively tip heavy. The 12' Iwana is 76g, it seems to be reasonably durable, and the likelihood of catching a larger fish is probably the same for either rod. I love my 12' Iwana, BTW!
Last edited by tiptop on Fri Feb 08, 2013 7:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby farmer » Fri Feb 08, 2013 5:19 am

Any more new rods or rod improvements coming our way in the near future? Sure would like to se a 15 footer. Doesn't have to zoom. Thanks. .
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Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby tsegelke » Fri Feb 08, 2013 6:47 am

Just a thought. I relate my rods to my casting approach. Am I looking for a Fast, Medium, or Slow for the conditions that day. Fast is a rod typically generating the power mostly by the limited flex in the tip. The casting pace is generally faster/shorter, and I use them for the longer casts, or casting in the wind, and weighted flies typically are easier to cast. Slow is a more supple rod, where the casting pace is longer/slower, is about line control or finesse instead of power. The flex is throughout the rod instead of just the tip. Medium is inbetween the two. About a mis flex, has some power/speed to the casting but slows down a bit to still lend to the feel of line control.

I generally seek the slower feel.
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Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby tntom » Fri Feb 08, 2013 7:25 am

Daniel @ Tenkara USA wrote:I did a writeup on the Ayu here: http://www.tenkarausa.com/blog/?p=4325
If TUSA really wants to improve the rods the weight should be considered.
- This is something I'm very observant of. There will be some lighter rods in the future, but the main thing I pay attention to is balance. I'm having a few of our main rods lean toward the heavier weight but very good balance, this will ensure their quality is not compromised with larger fish we find here. There are some rods that are super light but also break very easily, the new Ayu is very difficult to break on a fish.
And, part of the reason for going to a 6:4 is to get away from the classification system we have been using. It does not paint a complete picture but also confuses a lot of people. I'm still pondering the best way to approach this. My goal is to make super good tenkara rods, and I think the flex shouldn't matter so much to the end user. That's just my opinion, but I'm not yet settled on how to best approach this. Open to suggestions.


My new Ayu is on it's way my need a day off when it gets here. I just don't see the big deal with weight on a already light rod with no reel, backing or floating fly line. Give me a well balanced rod that will handle a 16" brown and Tenkara USA has done that with several of there rods. Thanks for great rods and great service Daniel.

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Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby jd_smith » Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:21 am

Daniel @ Tenkara USA wrote:I did a writeup on the Ayu here: http://www.tenkarausa.com/blog/?p=4325 This is something I'm very observant of. There will be some lighter rods in the future, but the main thing I pay attention to is balance. I'm having a few of our main rods lean toward the heavier weight but very good balance, this will ensure their quality is not compromised with larger fish we find here. There are some rods that are super light but also break very easily, the new Ayu is very difficult to break on a fish.
And, part of the reason for going to a 6:4 is to get away from the classification system we have been using. It does not paint a complete picture but also confuses a lot of people. I'm still pondering the best way to approach this. My goal is to make super good tenkara rods, and I think the flex shouldn't matter so much to the end user. That's just my opinion, but I'm not yet settled on how to best approach this. Open to suggestions.


Honestly I think that the rating system's that have been developed and or suggested by some are too confusing, or hard to understand or missing an element of description. I understand the flex system e.g 6:4, and the common cents e.g 17 penny's, and even the Tenkara guides system (maybe the best description and maybe the most confusing to some as well, and also too big for a label), but I think many people have trouble with them.

I think a simpler system has been overlooked by just using the # system coupled with the flex rating. I get that a rod is 5:5 or 6:4 or 7:3, that will best describe the flex of the rod, but gives little information as to the power of the rod. If a simple # system, maybe from 1 to 5, was incorporated with the flex rating I think this whole kerfuffle could be greatly simplified for a mainstream approach.
Examples Amago 6:4 #5 or Iwana 6:4 #3.

Another thought would be to use elegant names coupled with flex ratings. Something like hmmm I don't know, how about Headwaters=Light, Midstream=Medium and Mainstream=Heavy. You would have a rod labeled something like this...Headwaters 300cm 7:3 or Mainstream 410cm 6:4 or Midstream 360cm 5:5. With one of these systems it would be clear that with a Headwaters 7:3/or #1 7:3 rod, you will be targeting small fish. This rod will be soft but it can still be a crisp/fast rod at 7:3. Adversely a rod that is labeled as a Mainstream 6:4/or #5 6:4. This would indicate a rod with the most power and a medium fast tip. A rod labeled Midstream 5:5/or #3 5:5 is a full flex rod with medium power. Just my thoughts.

JD
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Re: New Ayu series II is now availible.

Postby jd_smith » Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:46 pm

More in regards to the confusion of the rating system.

A week or so ago I posted a tenkara related question on another fishing forum and a reply that I got from one guy was disturbing. This guy had bought a TenkaraUSA rod from a fly shop that sale's TUSA rods. (one of the first shop's to do so I'm sure of it). When I asked him "what rod did you choose?" his reply was "I purchased the Iwana 11 footer. It is supposed to be for big fish big water. It seems to work very well, but have nothing to compare it to." Holly crap this is my local fly shop and I'm going to ask them how this happened. Who the hell told this gentleman that the Iwana 11 or the 12 footer for that mater is a big fish big water rod? For crying out loud, if I've taught them one thing it's that I've taught them nothing about tenkara. Ever feel like your talking to a wall? That's how I felt when I read his reply.

If this dealer and fly shop (a shop BTW that just so happens to be the very first FLY ONLY shop in the world) can't get it right, then something needs to be simplified for sure!!! Of course this could be all his misunderstanding so until I find out more I won't lose any sleep over it. But the fact still remains that one of them is confused!

JD
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